Bombing
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- 23/11/2016 14:32:00 #2023081777655852Nick ForderParticipant
I have a reference that the RFC dropped its first bombs in anger on 29.8.1914, and routine orders were issued on 31.8.1914 that incendiary bombs (a gallon of petrol carried in a streamlined canister which ignited on impact with the ground, according to McCudden)and grenades were to be carried on recce sorties from then on. On 1.9.1914 two bombs were dropped on German cavalry north of Villers-Cotterets.
Can anyone provide any details of who did the bombing ?
Also, McCudden mentions a red painted 10 lb shrapnel bomb, with a small parachute attached to it to provide directional stability, which was issued to 3 Squadron at about the same time (September 1914 ?) as the French 155 mm Melinite converted artillery shell bomb. I can find no reference to the British producing the 10 lb shrapnel bomb: was it French ?
03/12/2016 18:33:00 #2023081777656076Michael MeechParticipantHi
The Official History of the Ministry of Munitions Volume XII ‘The Supply of Munitions’, Part II ‘Aerial Bombs’, page 5, mentions that at the outbreak of war the types in use were the Hale 20-pounder and the naval 112-pounder. It continues:
“At the end of 1914 the aerial bombs in use were high explosive bombs of R.L. design weighing 112 lbs., 20 lbs. and 10 lbs., and the Cotton Powder Company’s 10-lb. and 20-lb. Hale bombs.”
On incendiary bombs it mentions (pages 7-8) that:
“The earliest kinds of incendiary bomb were petrol bombs of two types, large and small, composed of cases of tin and copper spinning containing petrol. At the end of 1914 other types in use were a 20-pounder filled with incendiary composition and powder, with a nose fuse, a second 20-pounder containing trotyl and petrol with Very cartridge and striker, and a 10-lb. bomb filled with carcass powder.”
Other information on WW1 bombs is to be found in ‘Bombs Gone’ by Wing Commander John A. MacBean and Major Arthur S. Hogben. This includes some drawing of some of the types but covers weapons up to 1990.
I hope that is of a little help.
Mike
06/12/2016 22:16:00 #2023081777656081Michael MeechParticipantHi
As a previous post I made ‘timed out’ again I have attached the following:
07/12/2016 10:20:00 #2023081777656083Nick ForderParticipantHi Mike
Yes, I have looked at the Martel translation which, if nothing else, demonstrates the need to address the general lack of English study of French air operations !I agree totally about the eyewitness accounts, especially as, in the case of Courtney, a number of his recollections don’t quite match the documentation (which may not have been available to him to support his memory). However, if the Ministry of Munitions volume is to be taken at face value, Courtney’s account of bombing is more relevant to 1914 than 1915.
The answer might be with the ‘system’ for fitting war equipment to new aircraft prior to the decision to delivery them to St Omer (& Candas etc). If this wasn’t done by the manufacturer, it had to be done on the Squadron and, as the aircraft were used for a range of roles, the equipment had to be removable. So, a lot of scope for initiative !
There is an official manual on aerial bombs (1915 ?), a copy of which I had until I (perhaps foolishly) loaned it out and it has yet to return. I will have to track that down as I recall that it provided much more detail that Hogden & Bean (which is a WW2-biased history with a WW1 intro)though I don’t know if it covers ‘homemade bombs’. Duxford has a small number of the latter (in store), about which no one seems to know much.
Nick07/12/2016 11:39:00 #2023081777656087Michael MeechParticipantHi Nick
Reference the French, I agree, although I have undertaken a fair bit of research on French Air/Infantry co-operation (which I will have to review when I have time) from many documents that are available due to correspondence between the RFC and the French plus the translations of French documents that the US undertook. This role is not covered particularly well, if at all, in books on the French air arm.
Bomb racks etc. were always a responsibility of the squadron to fit, even in August 1918, as is clear from documents of the time. Another example is Klaxons, that are fitted in various locations on aircraft, it was down to the preference of the squadron.
Mike
07/12/2016 13:10:00 #2023081777656089Nick ForderParticipantHi Mike
I agree that there is a lot more about the French available in French, but limited sources in English without looking at primary sources, as you have done.Maybe I should have specified the mounting for the racks, rather than the racks themselves !
Certainly when adding mounts for cameras a lot of work was carried out at the ADs as this was more practical than dealing with the manufacturers or doing it on the squadrons. See, for instance, the recent back page of the Journal images of the camera fitting on the Morane parasol.
Nick20/12/2016 09:22:00 #2023081777656103Nick ForderParticipantRanken Dart, Hale, Cooper & 112 lb bombs at IWM Duxford
20/12/2016 09:25:00 #2023081777656105Nick ForderParticipantSN bomb IWM Duxford
20/12/2016 09:31:00 #2023081777656107Nick ForderParticipantUnidentified bomb at IWM Duxford, possibly FRench ?
20/12/2016 09:33:00 #2023081777656109Nick ForderParticipantAnd another..
18/01/2017 12:04:00 #2023081777656137Nick ForderParticipantRobert Loraine, 3 Squadron, noted on 1.11.1914 “Left at 2 pm with Pilot Birch on a Bleriot. The machine could not climb well with weight of bombs. Dropped bombs on Gheluwe at a height of 3,700 feet, 3 Reds, 10 hand grenades.” Target was the Kaiser. I assume that the ‘Reds’ were the same type of bomb mentioned by McCudden ?
31/01/2017 10:34:00 #2023081777656154Nick ForderParticipantType From Casing Filling weight (lbs) Filling type Length (inches) Diameter
16 lb RL (Royal Laboratory) HE (High Explosive) 1914 Mild steel 7.0 TNT 19.5 5.020 lb Hale HE 1914 Cast/forged steel 4.5 Amatol 23.25 5.0
20 lb Cooper HE 1917 Cast/ heavy steel 4.5/ 5.5 Amatol TNT 24.5 5.1
50 lb RL HE 1917 Cast/ heavy iron 10.0 Amatol 28.25 7.0
65 lb RL HE 1915 Light/ mild steel 37.0 Amatol 29.75 9.0
100 lb RL HE 1914 Light/ mild steel 60.0 Amatol 29.75 11.5
112 lb RL HE 1914 Cast/heavy steel 35.0/40.0 Amatol TNT 29.0 9.0
180 lb RL HE Armour Piercing 1915 Cast/heavy steel 21.0 Amatol 29.0 9.4
230 lb RAF (Royal Aircraft Factory) HE 1916 Light/ mild steel 110.0/140.0 Amatol 50.5 10.0
250 lb RL HE 1916 Cast/heavy steel 110.0 Amatol 36.3 12.5
336 lb RAF HE 1916 Cast/heavy steel 70.0 TNT 59.5/53.25 14.0
520 lb RL HE 1917 Light/ mild steel 273.0/354.0 Amatol TNT 61.0 19.0
520 lb RAF HE 1917 Light/ mild steel 280.0/356.0 Amatol TNT 61.0 19.0
550 lb RL HE 1917 Cast/heavy steel 157.0/200.0 Amatol TNT 61.0 15.0
550 lb RAF HE 1917 Cast/heavy steel 157.0/200.0 Amatol TNT 61.0 15.0
1650 lb SN (Essen) HE 1918 Light/ mild steel plate 800.0 Amatol 132.0 18.5
3300 lb SN HE 1918 Light/ mild steel 1500.0 Amatol 171.0 22.5
6.5 oz Incendiary 1918 Aluminium tube 2.5 oz Cendite 6.0 0.75
3.45 inch Incendiary (with Hooks) 1915 Tin plate Carcass Composition 8.2 3.45
10 lb Incendiary Carcass 1915 Tin plate 8.5 Carcass Composition 19.25 5.0
40 lb Incendiary 1916 Tin plate 30.0 Phosphorus 20.6 8.0
Small Petrol Bomb 1914 Tin plate 6.0 pints Petrol
Large Petrol Bomb 1915 Tin plate 18.0 pints Petrol
Ranken Dart Tin plate 5.25 1.0
Source: Bombs Gone, MacBean & Hogben
07/02/2017 17:24:00 #2023081777656158Nick ForderParticipant“The first real bomb-sights were received in time to be used in the battle (of Loos).”
War in the Air, Vol 2, P118 - AuthorPosts
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